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[thorhammer]

Yep, I still haven't grown out of the tadpole pond. I have a question. Again. Maybe this will spark a good discussion that might even be helpful to others down the track. I tend toward the long-winded for which I most unabashedly do not apologise - I do have a point. Bear with me.

I practice yoga, in the sense of the modern fad for yoga-as-fitness. I also practice yoga in the sense that Crowley advocates, though not well. I work hard at it though. I have always seen the use of the body as a magickal act, and thus my physical life is a constant sacrament, always being perfected and tweaked towards what I feel is the ultimate in Niyama (loosely, clean-living). Hence my understanding of movement as meditation is deeper than most; karate, tai chi and yoga have all played an instrumental part in my spiritual formation.

In the use of my body as a magickal tool/weapon, I have come to realise recently that in the practice of Western esotericism/magick, there are a number of different aspects of physicality, aside from sex magick which I am not going to touch on (please do me the courtesy of leaving it out as far as possible - it will only confuse me here). These aspects are:

1. yoga in the Crowleyan sense (one asana practiced for the purpose of focusing the mind)
2. the drawing of sigils and marks such as for Goetic daemons and the Pentagrams, Hexagrams, Mark of the Beast etc.
3. the assumption of God-forms
4. the signs of the grades, of L.V.X., N.O.X., Mater Triumphans etc.

I *get* 1. and 2. I'm working on 1. and making good progress from a standing start; the use of 2. has always been a part of my (romanticised) imaginings of ceremonial magick. These I'm cool with.

3. is difficult for me. I've practiced a little with Hoor-Pa-Kraat after reading Rodney Orpheus' Abrahadabra and I found it a very tiring and challenging but ultimately somewhat successful practice. I need to keep working on it, but I don't know enough about the other Gods to work with them as well, and I know that using only one will skew my growth. Also . . . what's it for??? What's the point of it??? Halp!

4., though, is the biggest thing for me. Reading the descriptions of rituals (let's use Liber Resh vel Helios as the example) gives me the impression that one makes the gestures then speaks. I watched a video on youtube recently that I think ceewayne recommended, of the Star Ruby being performed, and the guy doing it made a flurry of movements with his arms that made him look like nothing so much as Michael Jackson and I fully expected that dodgy eighties pirouette to come out. Then he began speaking. I personally got the sense during performing the rituals (Resh again) that the signs are meant to accompany the words. So when I do my dawn Resh, I make Isis Mourning (L.) along with "Hail unto thee . . . strength"; Typhon (V.) with "Who sailest(/travellest) across . . . helm."; and Osiris Risen (X.) with "Hail unto thee . . . night." Now, I know that someone will say do what's right for me, and I am, but I have a broader question.

What the hell do they all mean? In the example of Resh, I can see the three signs as enacting the story of Osiris' death etc, which is okay. I won't even get into the question of how "Old Aeon" that feels to me. But what about the rest of it? I guess I want to know what intent to inject into the making of these signs, as I find them difficult to do with anything approaching meaning. If I'm not feeling ridiculous, that's only because I'm getting inured to the ridiculousness of them.

Wisdom, please?

P.S. I will probably post this on another forum. Just so you all know. Let me know if that's a problem.

[ceewayne]

Thorhammer

You write the good questions!

Also . . . what's it for??? What's the point of it??? Halp!

I have found Godforms to be useful in three ways

1. To bring what is lacking in your life. A God is an archtype and can be used as such.
2. A very good way to praise. To show attention to a God is praise. Doing it as a godform is a very powerful way.
3. As part of a ritual, have one person do the Godform and you can praise right there.

As for not knowing about the other Gods, that is what research is for. Pick a God and get cracking with the pen and book.

I guess I want to know what intent to inject into the making of these signs, as I find them difficult to do with anything approaching meaning.

The problem with watching a video is that you only see the outward forms of what is going on. Lets look at the Star Ruby for example. I ran into the same problem about the Signs of N.O.X., so I did a bit of research on what they are to symbolize and now when I do the gestures I think the following while doing them.

a. Puer - Khem - he was the god of reproduction; as Khnum, he was the creator of all things, "the maker of gods and men"- Creation

b. Vir - Amoun who comes at the voice of the poor in distress, who gives breath to him who is wretched..You are Amun, the Lord of the silent, who comes at the voice of the poor, when I call to you in my distress You come and rescue me...Though the servant was disposed to do evil, the Lord is disposed to forgive. The Lord of Thebes spends not a whole day in anger, His wrath passes in a moment, none remains. His breath comes back to us in mercy..May your ka be kind, may you forgive, It shall not happen again. – Support - kindness - force used to defend.

c. Puella - The Goddess Aphrodite as she prepared for the ritual bath that restored her purity. The Babe of the Abyss. Returning to a state of grace. Very useful after a day at work.

d. Mulier - Sign of Babalon. Babalon Herself. Being receptive to forces. Like saying, I am here, zap me!

e. Isis Rejoicing – Maternal Feelings. To everyone, including yourself.

Note, these are my images, everyone has a different way to seeing these, I just find they work for me. I am not a final authority for anything.

Does any of this help?I am at work right now so these thoughts are pretty quick.

[thorhammer]

Hi, Chris, and thanks for answering me as always. Your points on Godforms are excellent, and that's just what I was looking for, that kind of . . . theology? Stuff, anyway.

Originally Posted by ceewayne

As for not knowing about the other Gods, that is what research is for. Pick a God and get cracking with the pen and book.

Yeah, okay, fair point

Your discussion of N.O.X. seems similar to my understanding of the L.V.X., so I figure I'm on the right track with the way I'm thinking about it.

Maybe I'll design a ritual with just gestures. Yeah, the more I think about that, the more awesomely educational and edifying it seems.

I'll work on it.

Thankyou so much.